How are Hinduism and Sikhism related, considering they both originated in Punjab, India?
09.06.2025 06:42
I am like a fish out of water,
Here ਰਾਮੈ is Rama and not just lord. Kabir died chanting the name of Rama DESPITE him not finding any result of penances done in holy cities in his previous birth. Another example to show how much Kabir valued personal devotion to Rama in his own NIRGUN style.
The divergence of Kabir’s views from Vedanta is seen in the fact that he fully opposed religious symbolism of ALL KINDS and not just IDOLS.
What do you think is the most powerful line in the song "Non, Je Ne Regrette Rien" by Édith Piaf?
Raamaanand's Lord and Master is the All-pervading Lord God.
As long as the mind is filled with the desire for heaven,
The Word of the Guru's Shabad eradicates the karma of millions of past actions. ||3||1||
Why am I so wanting to suck a penis?
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Sriraag / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 92
Now that my time to die has come, I have come to dwell at Magahar! ||3||
ਊਹਾਂ ਤਉ ਜਾਈਐ ਜਉ ਈਹਾਂ ਨ ਹੋਇ ॥੨॥
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Says Kabeer, unto whom should I tell this?
— Kabir, II.57, Translated by Rabindranath Tagore
Let's look at the views of Sant Kabir
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But we have actually seen how much Kabir is also rooted in the Vedantic concept of “supreme realization” but in a non-mainstream path.
Where should I go? My home is filled with bliss.
ਮੁਆ ਕਬੀਰੁ ਰਮਤ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਰਾਮੈ ॥੫॥੧੫॥
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There is my Lord self-revealed, and the scent of sandal and flowers dwells in those deeps.
There the streams of light flow in all directions, few are the men who can cross to that shore!
ਮਰਨੁ ਭਇਆ ਮਗਹਰ ਕੀ ਬਾਸੀ ॥੩॥
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Guru Nanak (right) and Bhai Mardana (foreground) with Bhagat Kabir (left). This painting is found in the B-40 Janamsakhi, written and painted in 1733. The painting was made by Alam Chand Raj
ਗਉੜੀ ਕਬੀਰ ਜੀ ਪੰਚਪਦੇ ॥
I am a sacrifice to You, O my True Guru.
Why is going on a date today so much different than it was when I was young?
ਪੂਜਾ ਕਰਉ ਨ ਨਿਵਾਜ ਗੁਜਾਰਉ ॥
ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥
ਪੂਜਨ ਚਾਲੀ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਠਾਇ ॥
ਜਿਉ ਜਲ ਛੋਡਿ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਭਇਓ ਮੀਨਾ ॥
Look within your heart, for there you will find both Karim and Ram;
Kabeer: O worthless mortal, do not lose the Naam, the Name of the Lord.
Wherever I go, I find water and stones.
यस्य देवे परा भक्तिः यथा देवे तथा गुरौ । तस्यैते कथिता ह्यर्थाः प्रकाशन्ते महात्मनः प्रकाशन्ते महात्मन इति ।
ਬਹੁਤੁ ਬਰਸ ਤਪੁ ਕੀਆ ਕਾਸੀ ॥
ਮੁਆ ਕਬੀਰੁ ਰਮਤ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਰਾਮੈ
The young and the old drink milk pudding, but these fools eat the cow's body.
ਕਹੁ ਗੁਰ ਗਜ ਸਿਵ ਸਭੁ ਕੋ ਜਾਨੈ ॥
My body and breath of life belong to Allah - to Raam - the God of both. ||4||
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Sain (a barber)
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Here ਨਿਰਗੁਣ is Nirgun and not just lord. This is just another example to show that Kabir himself continued in the NIRGUN BHAKTI path.
Shvetashvatara Upanishad (6.23)
ਏਕ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਲੇ ਰਿਦੈ ਨਮਸਕਾਰਉ ॥੩॥
— Kabir, III.2, Translated by Rabindranath Tagore
I left Benares - I had little common sense. ||1|| Pause ||
I have searched through all the Vedas and the Puraanas.
I am not a Hindu, nor am I a Muslim.
I am not a Hindu, nor am I a Muslim.
Ravidas (a chamar shoemaker)
ਤਬ ਲਗੁ ਹੋਇ ਨਹੀ ਚਰਨ ਨਿਵਾਸੁ ॥੩॥
ਨਾ ਹਮ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਨ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ॥
One day, a desire welled up in my mind.
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ਨਾ ਹਮ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਨ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ॥
Sikhism is a NIRGUN path descending from the Sant Sampraday of Ramanandacharya and traces its ideas to VEDANTA!
ਗੁਰ ਕਾ ਸਬਦੁ ਕਾਟੈ ਕੋਟਿ ਕਰਮ ॥੩॥੧॥
Meeting with the Guru, my Spiritual Teacher, I realize God, my Lord and Master. ||5||3||
With inadequate devotion, how can anyone swim across? ||4||
ਓਛੀ ਭਗਤਿ ਕੈਸੇ ਉਤਰਸਿ ਪਾਰੀ ॥੪॥
ਪੂਰਬ ਜਨਮ ਹਉ ਤਪ ਕਾ ਹੀਨਾ ॥੧॥
Ramanandacharya’s teachings were centered on pure and personal connection with the God Rama and didn’t believe in any kind of formal ritualism. He used the common vernacular language instead of Sanskrit so that everyone could understand.
ਅਬ ਕਹੁ ਰਾਮ ਕਵਨ ਗਤਿ ਮੋਰੀ ॥
Now tell me, Lord, what will my condition be?
That Kabeer died chanting the Lord's Name. ||5||15||
There is a reason why I mention ROOTED and thus NOT implying that it belongs to one of the numerous sects in Sanatana Dharma like Shaivism, Vaishnavism, Shaktism, Smartism etc…
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The influence of Kabir is significant on Sikhism. The following Bani from Ang 1136 is attributed to GURU ARJAN DEV but if you observe at the end you can see that he was talking in the spirit of Sant Kabir.
ਜਹਾ ਜਾਈਐ ਤਹ ਜਲ ਪਖਾਨ ॥
We can understand that Kabir despite being in favor of formless worship was very much embedded in the Dharmik fold but always preached in the spirit of the transcendental nature of Brahman to the point that HE LOST THE DISTINCTION BETWEEN HINDU AND MUSLIM.
Again we see that the originator of this Sant Sampraday himself talks about Brahman even in Gurbani.
Hari is in the East, Allah is in the West.
Kabir is the child of Allah and of Ram: He is my Guru, He is my Pir.
To him who is high-minded, these teachings will be illuminating.
Where millions of Vishnus bow their heads, where millions of Brahmas are reading the Vedas,
NOW…
ਬ੍ਰਹਮ is Brahm i.e the Brahman of vedanta but it gets interpreted as an all-pervading lord god.
then who is there to know what happens without?
Says Kabeer, this is what I say:
As mentioned above Guru Arjan Dev was talking from the perspective Sant Kabir whose views we have discussed much earlier here. We know that Sant Kabir continuing in the Ramanandi Sampradaya went further away from the mainstream ritualistic Hinduism and was journeying more towards a SEAMLESS Dharma.
These morons know nothing, they wander about in ignorance,
Kaashi and Magahar - I consider them the same.
You are totally pervading and permeating in all.
ਰਾਮਾਨੰਦ ਜੀ ਘਰੁ ੧
He does not dwell at the Lord's Feet. ||3||
I do not make pilgrimages to Mecca, nor do I worship at Hindu sacred shrines.
The Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, is heaven. ||4||10||
Without looking into one's heart, how can one reach paradise?
From where did the word Maya come? Isn’t it a typical Vedantic concept discussed profoundly in Advaita? It definitely isn’t a concept pioneered by Kabir or even his teacher Ramanandacharya! It is ultimately from Sanatana Dharma!
Actually, this part of the Ang 326 is widely used by McSikhs to show that Sikhism considers Hindu pilgrimages as useless and thus drives home the point again that the “religion” has got NOTHING to do with Hinduism.
ਕਾਸੀ ਮਗਹਰ ਸਮ ਬੀਚਾਰੀ ॥
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Recklessly they display boundless pride while explaining their own aims, they kill cows.
Kabir, Ravidas and ultimately the NINE SIKH GURUS are a product of this very Sant Sampraday founded by Ramanandacharya!
If God be within the mosque, then to whom does this world belong?
The Sant Sampraday of Sikh panth integrates the warrior spirit of the Nihangs and Khalsa, the service of Seva panth and the renunciation of Udasi/Nirmala saints.
ਕਬੀਰ ਨਿਰਗੁਣ ਨਾਮ ਨ ਰੋਸੁ ॥
Raamaanand's Lord and Master is the All-pervading Lord God.
ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹ ਕਹੀਐ ਕਾਹਿ ॥
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:
He accepted even women (Sursuri and Padywati) as disciples. Bhagat Pipa and Dhanna were Rajput and Jat who were also his disciples.
Sadhna (a Muslim butcher) and
ਅਲਹ ਰਾਮ ਕੇ ਪਿੰਡੁ ਪਰਾਨ ॥੪॥
Says Kabeer, the Guru and Ganaysha and Shiva all know
ਕਤ ਜਾਈਐ ਰੇ ਘਰ ਲਾਗੋ ਰੰਗੁ ॥
We can see that great saints like Kabir and Ravidas etc… descended from the Ramananda sampradaya which is still the largest ascetic order in India.
Now here in this verse
For a superficial McSikh who is interested only in separation and not enlightenment the views of Kabir can be easily shown as a denouncement of Hindu practices.
You have cut through all my confusion and doubt.
Sant Kabir was staunchly against cow slaughter.
Ramanandacharya was a 14th-century Hindu Vaishnava devotional poet saint who amalgamated Advaita with Vaishnava Bhakti. He was the pioneer in validating NIRGUN and SAGUN Bhakti as parallel paths.
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Gauri / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 325
Gauree, Kabeer Jee, Panch-Padas:
That God showed me the Guru, within my own mind. ||1||
Let’s look at the most used verse by McSikhs to show that Sikhs are neither Hindus nor Muslims.
ਸਗਲ ਜਨਮੁ ਸਿਵ ਪੁਰੀ ਗਵਾਇਆ ॥
— Kabir, Ramaini 1, Translated by David Lorenzen
I ground up sandalwood, along with several fragrant oils.
All the men and women of the world are His living forms.
ਜਬ ਲਗੁ ਮਨਿ ਬੈਕੁੰਠ ਕੀ ਆਸ ॥
Where millions of Shivas are lost in contemplation, where millions of Indras dwell in the sky,
I would go there, only if the Lord were not here. ||2||
ਰਾਮਾਨੰਦ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਰਮਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ॥
For him Dharma was beyond everything physical including the desire for heaven because was fully into the NIRGUN . The last verse shows that according to him the company of the enlightened Sadhus is heaven which is again a typical teaching of Sanatana Dharma.
Because in my previous life, I did not practice penance and intense meditation. ||1||
So in the same spirit Kabir finds pilgrimages to holy cities futile as his mind is fixated on Rama!
ਬੇਦ ਪੁਰਾਨ ਸਭ ਦੇਖੇ ਜੋਇ ॥
ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਬੈਕੁੰਠੈ ਆਹਿ ॥੪॥੧੦॥
ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਮੈ ਬਲਿਹਾਰੀ ਤੋਰ ॥
CONCLUSION:
ਜਿਨਿ ਸਕਲ ਬਿਕਲ ਭ੍ਰਮ ਕਾਟੇ ਮੋਰ ॥
ਘਸਿ ਚੰਦਨ ਚੋਆ ਬਹੁ ਸੁਗੰਧ ॥
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ਤਜੀ ਲੇ ਬਨਾਰਸ ਮਤਿ ਭਈ ਥੋਰੀ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
I have taken the One Formless Lord into my heart; I humbly worship Him there. ||3||
How can they kill the mother, whose milk they drink like that of a wet nurse?
Ramarchan Paddati gives more info about his teachings.
My consciousness does not go out wandering. My mind has become crippled. ||1|| Pause ||
ਮੇਰਾ ਚਿਤੁ ਨ ਚਲੈ ਮਨੁ ਭਇਓ ਪੰਗੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Where spring, the lord of seasons reigneth, there the unstruck music sounds of itself,
I do not perform Hindu worship services, nor do I offer the Muslim prayers.
ਮਰਤੀ ਬਾਰ ਮਗਹਰਿ ਉਠਿ ਆਇਆ ॥੨॥
I serve the One Lord, and not any other. ||2||
ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹੁ ਕੀਆ ਵਖਾਨਾ ॥
Let’s see what Gurbani has about Ramanandacharya’s views.
Bhakti movement began in South (Tamil Nadu to be precise) and slowly spread to Northern parts of India. This movement was extremely popular because of its simple fundamentals which could be understood by even commonfolk. Vaishnavism, Shaivism etc… were already connecting with commonfolk from a long time and this Bhakti movement reinforced it by making the devotee feel a personal connection with the deity.
ਤੂ ਪੂਰਿ ਰਹਿਓ ਹੈ ਸਭ ਸਮਾਨ ॥
From Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 1195
I wasted my whole life in the city of Shiva;
Sikhism is fundamentally rooted in BHAKTI tradition and thus ultimately in Sanatana Dharma. There is no doubt about it despite what modern McSikh acrobatics try to claim otherwise
ਸੋ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਬਤਾਇਓ ਗੁਰ ਮਨ ਹੀ ਮਾਹਿ ॥੧॥
For many years, I practiced penance and intense meditation at Kaashi;
At the time of my death, I moved to Magahar. ||2||
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Gauri / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 326
Where the demi-gods and the munis are unnumbered, where millions of Saraswatis, goddess of music play the vina,
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Gauri / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 325
ਹਜ ਕਾਬੈ ਜਾਉ ਨ ਤੀਰਥ ਪੂਜਾ ॥
ਏਕੋ ਸੇਵੀ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਦੂਜਾ ॥੨॥
ਰਾਮਾਨੰਦ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਰਮਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ॥
We have searched the turaki Dharam (Turk's religion, Islam), these teachers throw many thunderbolts,
Ramananda accepted disciples without discriminating against anyone by gender, class or caste and they included even people from humble origins like
Raamaanand Jee, First House:
I went to God's place, and worshipped Him there.
ਗੁਰ ਪੀਰ ਮਿਲਿ ਖੁਦਿ ਖਸਮੁ ਪਛਾਨਾ ॥੫॥੩॥
ਕੈਸੇ ਬੂਝੈ ਜਬ ਮੋਹਿਆ ਹੈ ਮਾਇਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Kabir (a weaver)
If Ram be within the image which you find upon your pilgrimage,
ਏਕ ਦਿਵਸ ਮਨ ਭਈ ਉਮੰਗ ॥
There, where millions of Krishnas stand with hands folded,
He who has highest Bhakti of Deva (God), just like his Deva, so for his Guru (teacher),
How can people understand You, when they are entranced by Maya? ||1|| Pause ||
The views of Kabir are very much in parallel to the Advaita philosophy and it is obvious that as the disciple of Ramanandacharya he will carry forward with his chosen NIRGUN BHAKTI.